Selling Citizenship

[pingers]

Would you sell your citizenship for 60-100k? I didn't realise there was a large market for this. I've been noticing some of my friends that are doing fake marriages to allow the lady to stay in Australia permanently on citizenship. It's crazy.

[Alan86]

It depends on all the issues involved. You'd have to know all the legal ramifications. I'm sure there are a few, otherwise every second person would be doing it.

[local]

It depends on all the issues involved. You'd have to know all the legal ramifications. I'm sure there are a few, otherwise every second person would be doing it.

Well there are also a bunch of no hopers out there who are not even selling but are being used.
I know of a useless twit who couldn't get a fuck in a brothel had a desperate girl approach him in the street and she just kissed him. stayed and talked and ended up marrying the guy.
He thinks its love !! yeah we all know what it is really. I think he will find out in another 6 to 9 months (& no it wont be a kid).

[blanet]

The time investment and effort needed to maintain the lie to avoid government suspicion wouldn't be worth it. But 100k can buy a lot of punts..

[rooter]

Sounds like easy money, but when she divorces you a few years later and takes half of your house you won't be smiling anymore ;)

[NigStick]

Sounds like easy money, but when she divorces you a few years later and takes half of your house you won't be smiling anymore ;)

I think they would have an agreement before marriage to protect the seller

[wilisno]

Would you sell your citizenship for 60-100k? I didn't realise there was a large market for this. I've been noticing some of my friends that are doing fake marriages to allow the lady to stay in Australia permanently on citizenship. It's crazy.

You can't sell your citizenship, after the girl gets her citizenship, you still keep yours, so you haven't sold it ! ;) ;) ;)

And also, you can't grant her a citizenship, it's still up to the Immigration Department to decide !

[rooter]

What we are talking about here is a girl from let's say Thailand entering into a sham marriage with an Australian citizen (or permanent resident) just for the sake of getting permanent residence. Whether she then becomes a citizen too is up to her.
The immigration department is well aware of this practice and so will investigate the matter (including home visits) especially for people from certain countries.
And you will be required to sign various legal documentation swearing it's a genuine marriage.
So if you make false statements you are probably committing an offence too, which probably carries heavy fines.
It's not something to be taken lightly.
I'm no lawyer so I am just guessing, but if you are seriously considering this then get some professional legal advice first.

[local]

You would need a pre-nup that entitles you to half of what is hers, not the other way around. I imagine a WL can earn some decent money over two or three years.

Pre-nups, are not necessarily binding, plenty of law & judgements on this issue.

[local]

What we are talking about here is a girl from let's say Thailand entering into a sham marriage with an Australian citizen (or permanent resident) just for the sake of getting permanent residence. Whether she then becomes a citizen too is up to her.
The immigration department is well aware of this practice and so will investigate the matter (including home visits) especially for people from certain countries.
And you will be required to sign various legal documentation swearing it's a genuine marriage.
So if you make false statements you are probably committing an offence too, which probably carries heavy fines.
It's not something to be taken lightly.
I'm no lawyer so I am just guessing, but if you are seriously considering this then get some professional legal advice first.

Its actually a legal minefield.
A friend of mine years ago, entered into an arrangement with a young Japanese girl, after actually going to Japan and meeting her family and everything.
OK, She was 22 and he was 45.
He got on very well with the family and found out the truth of the deal and came to an arrangement with them.
Its now 20 years later and he and his Japanese wife have 8 children, and her parents and 3 brothers and their wives and families all living together in the same "compound (not the same house)" on a property in north Queensland.
Funny bit, her father is still "financing" everything.
(yes he [her father] is missing a finger or two as well).

[cuteguy]

Its actually a legal minefield.
A friend of mine years ago, entered into an arrangement with a young Japanese girl, after actually going to Japan and meeting her family and everything.
OK, She was 22 and he was 45.
He got on very well with the family and found out the truth of the deal and came to an arrangement with them.
Its now 20 years later and he and his Japanese wife have 8 children, and her parents and 3 brothers and their wives and families all living together in the same "compound (not the same house)" on a property in north Queensland.
Funny bit, her father is still "financing" everything.
(yes he [her father] is missing a finger or two as well).

He was very fortunate to meet a lovely girl who didn't take him for a ride and made him lose more than what he bargained for when entering into this arrangement.

[Alan86]

Well there are also a bunch of no hopers out there who are not even selling but are being used.
I know of a useless twit who couldn't get a fuck in a brothel had a desperate girl approach him in the street and she just kissed him. stayed and talked and ended up marrying the guy.
He thinks its love !! yeah we all know what it is really. I think he will find out in another 6 to 9 months (& no it wont be a kid).

Lol!

That's been going on for donkeys years! There's so many men and women who marry people for the immigration , and end up divorcing them or running off.

What were talking about is a pre-arrangement where both parties know what's going on. The govt does not.

A lot of ppl do this around the world, inc Australia.

[Littlewonder]

Unfortunately there are men out there that want a lady partner and women out there that want to stay in Australia so they end up marrying. Unfortunately it usually ends in divorce and some times this is planned from the beginning and its just done for money. We as punters hear of it with the wl but I assume it can also happen with overseas males and Australian ladies.

I think its wrong but I don't know what can be done about it. The system is designed to look after people that fall in love and want a so called normal married life not just Australian Citizenship

Don't know what the solution is?

[corvus]

From a legal point of view a pre nup is hard to enforce. So many factors go into it. Equity plays a big part, not just common law.

If the citizenship is built into the prenup it may possiblity make the pre nup and the citizenship invalid. One cannot enter into contracts that are illegal.

If one enters into this sort of arrangement the best thing to do is to have a trust or some other vechile to hide his assets. Although even trusts are not very safe these days....

[nocturnalman]

Getting PR through a fake marriage is not as easy as most people think.I have lived in several countries for many years and I know lots of procedures ,
because I wanted to work in an Immigrant Department in the past.
There are many requirements that need to be met ,the simplest one of them is having a shared bank account.The person must be living with her partner at the same address for 2 years.There are many methods and ways to check whether a relationship is genuine and getting caught doing it for business /benefit will end nasty for both parties.

[aussiegaigin]

As well as the 2 year requirement, there is (used to be) a further probation period befor PR is confirmed. I think depends on the girl's existing visa

[gentlescream]

Just to add: the female will be on a preliminary type visa visa a full PR is issued - 2 years I believe.

I know several parties that are involved in such arrangements. Worst case I heard was a guy suddenly returning to Korea upon the call of his parents (rich parent, mama's boy), about a fortnight after the visa application went in. Girl called me, furiously explaining her situation. Had to follow the guy to keep the same address and they're now about 6 months into the arrangement and from the looks of it, hanging by the thread - guy's parents bound to find out sooner or later.

That aside - I've actually received offers myself to enter that arrangement...man, it's been tempting. Market price has been about $80k. Usually had some timing issues + due to the nature of my job - would probably been in jeopardy status if I entered the agreement.

Could definitely use that cash though. From what I understand, when they enter into the agreement, there's also an unofficial agreement about allowing "free sex" whenever the guy wants and what not.

[local]

As well as the 2 year requirement, there is (used to be) a further probation period befor PR is confirmed. I think depends on the girl's existing visa

What most of them tend to forget is the "exams".

I remember a few years ago a guy I know ask me to help him and his "wife" pass the exams, well honestly, that fact she didn't actually any any clothes at their "common abode" got the quetion of where does she live ? and it wasn't together.... absolutely no hope and they failed, she's back in China and remarried and he's still trying to get a divorce !!

[nocturnalman]

I tend to agree. The rules have changed a lot, and it now takes a few years and a lot more formalities before they get full residency. It is sad that people are abusing the system.

Systems are abused in every country.Australias requirements are a joke compared to other countries.In Finnland for example ,you must have a certain income and a place to live with a certain amount of rooms
for the first stage of the visa.Then you have to wait about 2-3 years ,and then they will check the if you still satisfy the first requirements apart from the other requirements.
In Germany ,the department of immigration will send the police to where you and the women are supposed to live from time to time and they will check if she really lived there.
They might look at how many toothbrushes are at the home ,if she has shoes there (women tend to have lots of shoes) ,they will ask the neighbors how many times a week they see the women ,
they might monitor her movements and lots of other things.
And there are other countries where the women gets a longtime-visa when married to a citizen but once they divorce they will take back the visa and deport her.

[aussiegaigin]

Some of the rules just don't make sense.

A few years back I had a lot dealing with Japanese on working holiday or student visas. When their time was up, they would try and get ordinary tourist visas to stay longer. "Not allowed, you have to go back". So they would fly over to NZ or Singapore, and apply for a 3 month tourist visa there, and back in Sydney within a few days, no questions asked.

[local]

Some of the rules just don't make sense.

A few years back I had a lot dealing with Japanese on working holiday or student visas. When their time was up, they would try and get ordinary tourist visas to stay longer. "Not allowed, you have to go back". So they would fly over to NZ or Singapore, and apply for a 3 month tourist visa there, and back in Sydney within a few days, no questions asked.

Ahh, but these were not for citizenship. But point taken.

I know one who "paper" married her cousin to get in the country. After 12 months he wanted to marry his girl friend so they had to "thai divorce" (which technically not recognised here). She has now picked up a dumb aussie and getting married in a few months. I wonder how immigration will look at the change of spouse ?

[the_boss_king]

i wouldn't sell my citizenship lol. shed be taking way more when we divorce not worth it. unless u plan on being broke for the next few years

[nocturnalman]

i wouldn't sell my citizenship lol. shed be taking way more when we divorce not worth it. unless u plan on being broke for the next few years

you can't sell it ,the most you could do would be sponsoring for PR

[aussiegaigin]

Just to add: the female will be on a preliminary type visa visa a full PR is issued - 2 years I believe.


I believe that is correct, I also think the girl has to have been living here for at least 12 months before applying. And may have to go back home after applying if her current visa has expired.

[nocturnalman]

I believe that is correct, I also think the girl has to have been living here for at least 12 months before applying. And may have to go back home after applying if her current visa has expired.

She has to go back if she overstayed her previous visa and landed on a Bridging Visa E.
They must have been in relation for at least 12 Months before she can apply for a Temporary Partner Visa.
After 2 years he can apply for PR

[Littlewonder]

I cannot agree with anyone selling their citizenship, but I do love almost anything that gets those lovely asian ladies to stay in Australia.

[nocturnalman]

I cannot agree with anyone selling their citizenship, but I do love almost anything that gets those lovely asian ladies to stay in Australia.

no worries ,others will come ,life is a cycle my friend

[cuteguy]

I came across a WL one time and she was so keen to stay in Australia. I mentioned to her that with her exposure to many customers that there might be at least one guy willing to assist in getting PR for her. You know what she said? She made it clear that she wasn't interested in any customers assisting her because if she did hook up with one, he would always know her work history and that is, she worked as a WL in Australia. If she met a guy here, he must not know anything about her secret life as a WL.

[Sam88]

I've seen some of our bros mentioning how they end up marrying some of the WLs ( cant remember where I read them ) but I really wonder how they work it out hey

[cuteguy]

I've seen some of our bros mentioning how they end up marrying some of the WLs ( cant remember where I read them ) but I really wonder how they work it out hey

Some WLs particularly from poor backgrounds might not be concerned about their husbands (previous customers) knowing that they were servicing many guys in the past but there are many WLs who will have nothing to do with customers at all.

[Sam88]

tough , i wonder if you'll still go see other WLs if you do end up marrying a WL. The wife would probably be suspicious of the husband all the time

[GoldfishMan]

One thing about divorce law in Australia. You don't actually lose half of everything when you divorce. Only the income and assets you have earned/obtained after you marry her are considered. Example, if you owned a house long before meeting her, then she will have no claim on that house. But if you bought a house after marrying her, pow she can take half of that house.
There are also a lot of things to consider, but generally Australia is quite lenient when it comes to divorce. Surely nothing like the US!

[aussiegaigin]

I cannot agree with anyone selling their citizenship, but I do love almost anything that gets those lovely asian ladies to stay in Australia.
You can't "sell your citizenship".

The inference is obtaining money to sponsor someone for residency status. You don't even need to be a citizen to do this; all you need is PR yourself.

[cuteguy]

I've heard a few girls reveal their unfortunate stories of being deceived by some clever guys who promised to assist them in getting their visa to stay here in return for sex. In the end, the guy leaves them after getting what he wanted and then the girls realise they spent so much time with one guy that their visa is about to expire that they get desperate asking guys to marry them. Who's going to do it when she's been with a guy for such a long period of time and gave him what he desired only to be thrown out like trash?

[aussiegaigin]

Let's not forget about all the guys who have been deceived by girls who get into relationships, then take the PR and run.

I've been let down by a couple of J girls, who've lived with me for an extended time, wanted marriage, then gone home to tell the parents, never to be heard from again.

[cuteguy]

Let's not forget about all the guys who have been deceived by girls who get into relationships, then take the PR and run.

I've been let down by a couple of J girls, who've lived with me for an extended time, wanted marriage, then gone home to tell the parents, never to be heard from again.

Yes, it works both ways too and many guys were left out in the cold by girls who told them that they loved them but instead just wanted to get their PR. Some even brought out their boyfriends from their country. I heard of cases where the guys were locked out of their own homes after the girl alleged domestic violence had been committed against them in order to remain in Australia.

[nocturnalman]

Yes, it works both ways too and many guys were left out in the cold by girls who told them that they loved them but instead just wanted to get their PR. Some even brought out their boyfriends from their country. I heard of cases where the guys were locked out of their own homes after the girl alleged domestic violence had been committed against them in order to remain in Australia.


Some Japanese said a person has 3 faces : one face he shows to the society ,one face he shows his friends and family and one face is that he shows no one and its between himself only

I say women have 4 faces .add all the three above plus one which is : the face of a snake

[cuteguy]

Some Japanese said a person has 3 faces : one face he shows to the society ,one face he shows his friends and family and one face is that he shows no one and its between himself only

I say women have 4 faces .add all the three above plus one which is : the face of a snake

Yes very true. Sometimes you might do a good deed for them only see them come back and bite you like a snake.