The Politics Thread - Sydney option

[GoldfishMan]

Do you know how much water is required to cool a nuclear reactor? It's around 60,000 litres per second. And it has to be pure fresh water, that can not be recycled. Australia is the driest continent on earth (only Antarctica has less rain); and we are near our limits for domestic and agricultural use as it is. We are already draining more out of the ground than can be replenished. It is sheer stupidity to further damage the artisan basin. Dutton's concept - note it is not a funded plan - for nuclear power stations, sometime in the distant future, is pure political sophistry. The only interest he is serving are the half dozen mining billionaires who worry about having stranded assets of fossil fuels. You are a fool if you believe a word Dutton says.

That's not true. Water used in a nuke reactor is within a "closed loop". As it cools the core, the water is heated into steam which is then condensed and fed back into the loop. This closed loop needs to be kept 100% water tight in a normal functioning reactor because any leakage can result in thermal runaway due to loss of coolant.

That 60k litres a second figure is probably the amount of water that is used within the system, but it's certainly not "lost". The same 60k litres will again go through the system at some point as the system cycles through.

[Double_Adapter]

Nah I’m paying attention to the CSIRO. https://www.csiro.au/en/news/all/art...2024/december/
.

Hey bro the link is dead?

Anyways, the CSIRO is a government funded entity and they get around $1bn a year carry out research. So any research which contradicts the government's agenda won't make the news and they'll probably get funding cuts in retaliation. In terms of bleeding edge research the CSIRO is ranked 20-30 in the world so there's better institutions out there - take the Vatican for example (now that is one fucked up organisation with many dark secrets).

I think all/most of these government funded organisations are full of horse shit! Take NASA for example they get around $20bn a year for producing a bunch of photoshopped images of the galaxy and planets...I reckon Escorts and Babes can produce better ps images than NASA.

Then they have the fucken hide to ask for more money so they can do more research, more photoshopping, and send a probe to Ur-anus (which a squillion light years away)....WTF!. If I was in charge of NASA I'd be saying 'there's a fucken plane that's been missing for 10 years it has MH370 stamped on it and it's somewhere in our backyard - now fuck off and don't come back until you find iit'

[HiredGoon]

I get my news from various independent sources...

Any examples of these sources?

[Wayne]

That's not true. Water used in a nuke reactor is within a "closed loop". As it cools the core, the water is heated into steam which is then condensed and fed back into the loop. This closed loop needs to be kept 100% water tight in a normal functioning reactor because any leakage can result in thermal runaway due to loss of coolant.

That 60k litres a second figure is probably the amount of water that is used within the system, but it's certainly not "lost". The same 60k litres will again go through the system at some point as the system cycles through.

No matter how sealed a system is, there will always be leakage. And that 60,000L/sec figure is present. Multiple that by factors of 1000 to include water storage for cooling. And this is for a small nuclear reactor. Dutton is proposing multiple, so you get these figures times 16 or 20 (depending on what day of the week he is speaking). The amount of water necessary is the realm of multiple sydharbs.

[HiredGoon]

Hey bro the link is dead?

Anyways, the CSIRO is a government funded entity and they get around $1bn a year carry out research. So any research which contradicts the government's agenda won't make the news and they'll probably get funding cuts in retaliation. In terms of bleeding edge research the CSIRO is ranked 20-30 in the world so there's better institutions out there - take the Vatican for example (now that is one fucked up organisation with many dark secrets).

I think all/most of these government funded organisations are full of horse shit! Take NASA for example they get around $20bn a year for producing a bunch of photoshopped images of the galaxy and planets...I reckon Escorts and Babes can produce better ps images than NASA.

Then they have the fucken hide to ask for more money so they can do more research, more photoshopping, and send a probe to Ur-anus (which a squillion light years away)....WTF!. If I was in charge of NASA I'd be saying 'there's a fucken plane that's been missing for 10 years it has MH370 stamped on it and it's somewhere in our backyard - now fuck off and don't come back until you find iit'

https://www.csiro.au/en/news/all/art...lear-explainer

So “mainstream media” and government agencies are both full of shit, so where did you get your information from? There was quite a bit on the csiro report in the news because Dutton immediately said it was wrong and the head of the csiro said politicians shouldn’t be undermining our institutions.

Not sure what nasa has to do with any of this.

[HiredGoon]

Although I did hear recently that NASA thinks there's a possibility there's life on my anus but I could've told them that there definitely is years ago so that's a huge waste of money.

[SinSeeker]

We should strategically build some large dams along the flood plains and solve the water issues then put the nuclear reactors nearby. Why not ask our largest trading partner aka the infrastructure giant to build everything. These mega projects can easily be funded by iron, coal, wine, lobster or natural gas.

Better still, if the government has the balls to cancel the AUKUS deal, we should have plenty of money to build everything we ever needed - as per Paul Keating.


Cheers

Nuclear energy is one of the most expensive sources of energy. There are plenty of independent studies conducted on that. Peter Dutton is obviously pandering to his oligarch masters, same as the liberal predecessors did with the AUKUS deal. If we had just continued with the submarine deal with France, even if we upgraded it to Nuclear, we would have got the submarines for billions of dollars less and decades earlier.

Solar is by far the cheapest source of electricity. Rather than spending billions of dollars on building nuclear reactors from scratch, wouldn't it be more logical to upgrade the networks to utilise the feed in electricity from household solar panels more efficiently?Heck, it would be cheaper to subsidise batteries as well.

I would say ANYONE BUT DUTTON. Racist MOFO!!

[dewayne]

Anyone complaining about the cost of solar or wind needs to look at alibaba for just 30 seconds and see that 100 big black dildos are $5 a piece but if you scale it up to 100000 big black dildos they become $2 a piece. Wind and solar is all made in China and becomes cheaper as you scale production. If we and other governments went in hard on wind and solar it would become cheap af very quickly.

[HiredGoon]

Anyone complaining about the cost of solar or wind needs to look at alibaba for just 30 seconds and see that 100 big black dildos are $5 a piece but if you scale it up to 100000 big black dildos they become $2 a piece. Wind and solar is all made in China and becomes cheaper as you scale production. If we and other governments went in hard on wind and solar it would become cheap af very quickly.

I dunno man, I'm still gonna wait for DoubleAdapters latest scientific report. CSIRO have no idea what they're talking about.

[Double_Adapter]

https://www.csiro.au/en/news/all/art...lear-explainer

So “mainstream media” and government agencies are both full of shit, so where did you get your information from? There was quite a bit on the csiro report in the news because Dutton immediately said it was wrong and the head of the csiro said politicians shouldn’t be undermining our institutions.

Not sure what nasa has to do with any of this.

Thanks bro, was beginning to get Reggie Bubble vibes as the bloke had the tendency to post dead links.

Anyhow, mainstream media is the modern day pied piper of Hamelin, and you know what they say about pied pipers - He who pays the piper calls the tune.
If you want real and unbiased information head over to the dark side....though most people get spooked out when going too deep and/or they're too fucken lazy so prefer to be spoon fed the daily diarrhea that mainstream media dishes out (and after a while the diarrhea begins to taste alright - so I've been told)....but it is what it is.

Anyways, never trust information from a 'gov' web site unless they owe you something which is as rare as hens teeth; governments love to tax what you earn, tax what you buy, and tax what you own and that's how they make money, and the more they tax the more money they get, therefore more dollars to waste and squander on frivolous idiotic useless bullshit programs.

In terms of NASA, just like CSIRO they're also a government funded institution (the shock the horror) but way bigger so the lies and bullshit is in a grand scale and subsequently the bullshit they dish out is easier to spot....a bit like spotting fakes in an escorts and babes ad; though some blokes here could do with a bit of help as they still can't figure out shit from clay.

[HiredGoon]

Thanks bro, was beginning to get Reggie Bubble vibes as the bloke had the tendency to post dead links.

Anyhow, mainstream media is the modern day pied piper of Hamelin, and you know what they say about pied pipers - He who pays the piper calls the tune.
If you want real and unbiased information head over to the dark side....though most people get spooked out when going too deep and/or they're too fucken lazy so prefer to be spoon fed the daily diarrhea that mainstream media dishes out (and after a while the diarrhea begins to taste alright - so I've been told)....but it is what it is.

Anyways, never trust information from a 'gov' web site unless they owe you something which is as rare as hens teeth; governments love to tax what you earn, tax what you buy, and tax what you own and that's how they make money, and the more they tax the more money they get, therefore more dollars to waste and squander on frivolous idiotic useless bullshit programs.

In terms of NASA, just like CSIRO they're also a government funded institution (the shock the horror) but way bigger so the lies and bullshit is in a grand scale and subsequently the bullshit they dish out is easier to spot....a bit like spotting fakes in an escorts and babes ad; though some blokes here could do with a bit of help as they still can't figure out shit from clay.

What is this "dark side" you speak of with real and unbiased information?

And do you trust non-government websites owned by private companies whose only motive is profit?

Also, what do you think the CSIRO's motive would be to say that nuclear power is prohibitively expensive?

[jiminy]

Picking between two dead beats. Reality is policy hasn’t changed much. 4 years one way then 4 years the other. All useless and conflicting.

[AHLUNGOR]

Dutton just announced a $1,200 tax cut next year if he wins. Plus the rebates for first home buyers.

Enough to win the election ?

[wilisno]

Dutton just announced a $1,200 tax cut next year if he wins. Plus the rebates for first home buyers.

Enough to win the election ?

Only if you believe that will happen.

[GoldfishMan]

Picking between two dead beats. Reality is policy hasn’t changed much. 4 years one way then 4 years the other. All useless and conflicting.

True, and unfortunately this is the outcome of democracy as we know it.

It's always been made out to be "complete freedom" to choose your leader, but in reality it always boils down to only a choice between 2 usually inept individuals. Sure you can try to vote for a small 3rd party or an independent out of frustration, but you're likely wasting your vote and worse, facilitating the creation of a minority government. That's the worst outcome you can get!

EDIT: I should add that this applies to us because we use the 2-party system.

[AHLUNGOR]

True, and unfortunately this is the outcome of democracy as we know it.

It's always been made out to be "complete freedom" to choose your leader, but in reality it always boils down to only a choice between 2 usually inept individuals. Sure you can try to vote for a small 3rd party or an independent out of frustration, but you're likely wasting your vote and worse, facilitating the creation of a minority government. That's the worst outcome you can get!

EDIT: I should add that this applies to us because we use the 2-party system.

Singapore has a free election systems but in reality, it's the same party which has ruled continuously since the separation from Malaysia.

[HiredGoon]

Dutton just announced a $1,200 tax cut next year if he wins. Plus the rebates for first home buyers.

Enough to win the election ?

A tax rebate for first homebuyers is a great way to push up house prices and does nothing for supply and Labor's plan isn't much better.

[Daysgone]

True, and unfortunately this is the outcome of democracy as we know it.

It's always been made out to be "complete freedom" to choose your leader, but in reality it always boils down to only a choice between 2 usually inept individuals. Sure you can try to vote for a small 3rd party or an independent out of frustration, but you're likely wasting your vote and worse, facilitating the creation of a minority government. That's the worst outcome you can get!

EDIT: I should add that this applies to us because we use the 2-party system.

This is understandably cynical given the sorry state of Australian politics. I too am cynical about the state of things, but I would point out that we do have a preference voting system to prevent "wasting your vote."

Preference votes are very significant in Australian politics as in Australia, independents and small parties regularly win seats.

If your first preference vote doesn't count, your second ends up counting, and so on. There are a lot of good alternatives to the major parties running in most electorates, and with a bit of research, a savvy voter can find one that best represents their interests.

Voting for an independent or smaller party has no downside. Votes aren't wasted, and the Electoral Commission provides the data on who was getting first preferences, which can influence future policy and election promises. For example, even if independent candidate Joey Bloggs doesn't get elected, if he gets enough first preference votes, the major parties are more likely to take on some of his ideas in the next election.

Furthermore, Australia does not have a two-party system. There are at least four dominant parties vying to form a government in any given election; Labor, Liberals, Nationals, and Liberal Nationals of Queensland. Only one of those parties has been able to win enough votes to form a government on their own since the Howard era. Minority governments are not a scary thing, but rather, are the norm in modern Australian politics. Every Federal Coalition government since Howard has, in fact, been a minority government in a technical sense. All it means is that the dominant political party needs to seek consent to govern and pass legislation from other parties and independents, which is the way that our system is meant to work. Sometimes people misunderstand the term "two-party preferred vote," which actually refers to a counting system, which is only used once there are only two parties left in the race as votes are being counted. This is not always Labor/Coalition, depending on the electorate and the individual election results.

I wish, as a nation, that we had better political literacy. There are lot of people who believe the myth of throwing votes away, and even more people who never do even cursory research on the candidates running in their electorate. I think it went down-hill when our leaders decided to stop teaching Civics and Citizenship as a mandatory subject in high schools. Current National Assessment data shows that less than 40% of Year 10 kids understand how our political system works. No doubt most of our politicians prefer it this way.

Personally, I don't like politics. I think there are some genuine, well-intended people who go into politics, but whose efforts are overshadowed by all the corrupt, greedy bullshit. That said, I still do my bit on election day. On election day, I will be giving my first preference to a local independent, and my second preference to one of the major parties.

TLDR: Use preference voting. Put a 1 next to your first preference, a 2 next to your second preference, and so on. It is not going to throw your vote away.

[SinSeeker]

Dutton just announced a $1,200 tax cut next year if he wins. Plus the rebates for first home buyers.

Enough to win the election ?

Can't see where he has promised that. Also can you trust Mr Backflip? Labour has promised a $1000 automatic deduction.

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[schloong]

A good post thanks Daysgone.

Unfortunately I have to agree with you regarding our lack of education on how our political "system" works, and it's just so crucial ass to how we function as a society.