China economy crisis - more MLC WLs onshore soon?

[begov94]

'It feels like you're trying to will an apparent "evil" into existence, and ignoring everything else in the process'

The OP started a thread
The original post, have a read, discusses the discussion by the President about the economy. Feel free to discuss the topic of this original post

This is what lava heads do. Maybe IRL they've been smacked around like donkeys so they lurk here as an "escape" from reality rather than share actual good information about where to get a good punt.

[begov94]

Am I correct that you haven't been to either of these countries you are talking about? Or even know anyone from these countries?

Believe what you want.
I have been deep enough to know that it is all smoke and mirrors. I have friends whose fathers work as government servants for the CCP. Bribery is very common - many of them even described the bribes as RMB100 notes rolled and packed neatly into cigarette boxes. If one box of 20 can hold RMB2,000 imagine how much is the total bribe when a whole carton is gifted that way.

My ex-wife was from Guangdong region right next to Guangzhou City. Her "village" is considered countryside although it's probably an hour walk to the city, and they still live in communal villages where everyone shares the same surname. Her younger brother and younger sister now lives in Guangzhou and are barely floating. The brother runs a real estate company pre-COVID, not sure if it's still around as the real estate bubble had burst. Maybe back then Guangzhou and other major cities were viewed as "much more prosperous" than Australia but you can't hide the fact that the economic bubble there bursts quite rapidly.

A friend who visited Shenzhen interviewed locals living and working there - many said that their jobs are quickly running out as the development phase is too rapid. Whenever Apple introduces a new product, no one wants to buy anything older than the current model so they lose out on all the unsellable stocks. I remember back in 2017, many Chinese friends laughed at me for owning an Oppo phone despite it coming from their country.

Even in SE Asia it's very similar - when development comes it is just too rapid for people to catch up. This is why many SE Asians still have that "village" mentality despite seeing modern development in major cities - but the problem is that the rural areas are still underdeveloped with electricity blackouts being very common because their electricity generator plants just don't have enough capacity to power the infrastructure.

I can see now why you talk the way you did - you've never seen an actual hard life in the rural areas before. You've never felt what it's like walking through paddy fields, herding livestocks and having to eat your own harvests. And here you're trying to talk about pussies as if they're toys solely for extracting sperm.

[begov94]

Thinking about it, that's probably the reason why my ex-wife sent money to her own bank account in China behind my back. The smoke and mirrors was starting to fade. But the problem is that she wouldn't come clean about it even after I confronted her, hence the reason for our divorce - not so much about the money but a lot about the broken trust.

That broken trust was enough for anyone to shut themselves in and become avoidant attached, but not for me.

[charmingninjaman]

Good point about China:

- Why did China aka the Middle Kingdom had to rise and fall 4 times in the past 3 thousand years?
- Why did Deng Xiaoping went against Mao's ideologies instead of follow through, especially in the "free market" policies?
- Why is China still an isolationist country up until today? Although only partially it is still trying to impose short term visitor visas where visitors HAVE to detail all their travels and stays, and only certain countries can enter China with visa on arrival.
- Why restrict travellers to Xinjiang and Tibet to strict monitored tours instead of free travel?
- Why do they not allow rural folks to enter big cities without proper permit?
- Why introduce the social demerit points system? And have facial recognition cameras everywhere?
- Why do you even live here in Australia if China is so damn "great"?
- Why is China disrespecting Hong Kong's autonomy and disrespecting Taiwan's border sovereignty despite international pressure?

Before you lava headed freaks hit the keyboard, take the time to think about these questions.

Thats a lot to go through, and to answer these questions properly would require historical context. I will try my best -

- Why did China aka the Middle Kingdom had to rise and fall 4 times in the past 3 thousand years?

Umm.... all great civilisations rise and fall. Isn't it a strength that the Middle Kingdom was able to come back 4 times? I don't think any other civilisation has achieved this feat? Do you think the US will still be the same 400 years from now?

- Why did Deng Xiaoping went against Mao's ideologies instead of follow through, especially in the "free market" policies?

It's no secret that Mao's great leap forward was a massive failure which caused the famine and deaths of millions. This was a mistake even the current day CCP acknowledge - hence the reason their government have been trying to obtain a balance between capitalist and socialist policies. Why is reform to something which works better suddenly seen as a negative?

- Why is China still an isolationist country up until today? Although only partially it is still trying to impose short term visitor visas where visitors HAVE to detail all their travels and stays, and only certain countries can enter China with visa on arrival.

Lol, isn't that the same as Australia and USA? It's common to put the reason of your stay on ANY Visa application (have you ever watched Border Force?).
China is the second largest economy in the world - over 140 million people visit China a year for holiday and business, would you really call that isolationist?


- Why restrict travellers to Xinjiang and Tibet to strict monitored tours instead of free travel?

Ummm...... again, I visited Tibet and we were able to freely go anywhere we wanted - so don't know what you referring to lol. I never been to Xinjiang, but have been to Qinghai - getting into Xinjiang again wouldnt have been a problem if I wanted to and some of the locals did suggest it to me due to my love for Uyghur food.



- Why do they not allow rural folks to enter big cities without proper permit?

This was already relaxed significantly in the 90's when urbanization started. China is a massive country with 1 billion people - can you imagine if all of them just crowded into Beijing? Would have been disastrous as all the working class people would have left the rural areas, leaving no one to produce food and provide services - don't forget, 30 years ago, they were still carrying water in buckets from the lake. They talking about relaxing it further this year as most areas in China including urban areas already have access to clean food and water.


- Why introduce the social demerit points system? And have facial recognition cameras everywhere?

When I ask my Chinese friends living in China about such a system - all of them are puzzled
Someone has already covered it - so maybe just go read this - https://www.technologyreview.com/202...-does-it-mean/

The source can also be confirmed elsewhere.

- Why do you even live here in Australia if China is so damn "great"?

Laughable question - many Australians love going to Bali and Thailand, why not go ask them why they aren't living there?
But if you must know - I was born in Australia, my family is here, all my business and assets are here. I might move to Asia for retirement as there is more to do there - but that is a fair while away.


- Why is China disrespecting Hong Kong's autonomy and disrespecting Taiwan's border sovereignty despite international pressure?

This is a question which is often asked by people who don't know how to see things through a historical context. Off top of my head, I can think of 3 things -
Opium Wars: Western powers forced China to cede territory and accept unequal treaties after profiting from drug trade.
Civil War: US backed KMT despite their loss, contributing to Taiwan's complex status.
Modern Era: US involvement in Asia raises questions about motivations and influence.

-----------------

The mistakes and greed of past Western governments and elites have led to many geopolitical issues we face today in Asia, the Middle East, and Africa.
And then you have all these Bogans complaining and wondering why other cultures outnumber their own in Australia
Most wouldn't have left their own country if it wasn't turned to shit by Western meddling.

[charmingninjaman]

Thinking about it, that's probably the reason why my ex-wife sent money to her own bank account in China behind my back. The smoke and mirrors was starting to fade. But the problem is that she wouldn't come clean about it even after I confronted her, hence the reason for our divorce - not so much about the money but a lot about the broken trust.

That broken trust was enough for anyone to shut themselves in and become avoidant attached, but not for me.

Ok, so this is the real reason you hate China. Understood

Let it go my man - I've had plenty shitty relationships, especially with Viets. But to me, pussy is pussy - could be good or bad regardless of the colour

[begov94]

Valid arguments. Then again here's my discussion:

Many other civilisations rise and fall as well. The Romans were replaced by the Byzantine's, The Mongols were replaced by the Dzungar Khanate that the Qing Dynasty feared the most and had to bribe other lesser Mongol tribes into destroying the Dzungar who ironically were their brethrens, Japan was temporarily administered after WWII and came back up, The Russian Empire were replaced by the Bolsheviks USSR and subsequently the Russian Federation. Your argument about China being the one and only "superpower" is irrelevant because you overlooked the other world powers which, similar to China, changed their names but still rule a similar plot of land.

In regards to Deng Xiaoping - I brought that up to showcase how your "China is great" argument is invalid because if that was the case, Deng Xiaoping would've followed through Mao's "perfect" ideology like how the Kims in North Korea maintained their outdated ones.

Your biased views on the foreign businesses conducted on Chinese soil fails to complete the isolationist argument. That's to showcase how much China is afraid that real news about it's rural poverty and dodgy constructions would be exposed if many tourists were given visa on arrival without scrutinising their itineraries. Just look up the serpentza and laowhy86 YouTube channels - they even provide all sorts of hard evidences of all the faults the CCP government was trying to hide.

Where did you go "freely" in Tibet? Do you even know the local Tibetan language? I sure do. More than just a simple "Tashi delek" or "Shogpa delek". I eat Tsampa on a regular basis, and I am also partly Tibetan. Your BS about walking freely in the whole of Tibet or the whole of Lhasa doesn't work on me.

As far as I know those permits for rural folks to enter big cities haven't been relaxed as you claim. There's still a huge number of permits not yet approved just to take care of the city's "image" to foreign businessman.

Bali is different from here. People go there purely as a holiday destination. Aussies are permitted to buy homes in Bali, many of them do but not as crazy as MLCs. Most MLCs come to Australia and don't even want to go back permanently because they know in the future their lives are fucked. Many of my Chinese friends say that themselves.

And you also fail to admit that it is the nature of many ARROGANT Chinese people to disrespect the autonomy and sovereignty of others like a Chihuahua trying to show off against a rottweiler. Just look at the South China Sea and Indian border mess.

Western meddling - if that's true you wouldn't call yourself an Aussie born. You'd be buying a one way ticket to China and kneeling in front of a Chinese citizenship office begging to be one of them.

One of my distant relative lived her whole life in China because she had no choice. More than a decade ago she finally found a way to leave China for good, came to Australia and never looked back. Would you call my distant relative a "traitor"? She was serving in the PLA's Airforce until retirement, mind you.

[HappyDongDong]

All you are referring to is your ex-wife, friends father, and know someone, but have you actually been to China yourself and when?

[begov94]

All you are referring to is your ex-wife, friends father, and know someone, but have you actually been to China yourself and when?

Changing the subject I see. Been to HK. Didn't bother going across the border - too much paperwork to fill out and the ex-wife was too lazy to detail all travel plans so she left me in HK for the day and returned back to HK the next day. Didn't get to see her family from marriage until divorce except for some of her uncles who lives here in Sydney.

HK not good enough for you? It's still one country, two "system".