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Yeah, protection wouldn't be the right word, more that I meant that I know many customers don't enjoy the neg part of the transaction with ML's, esp if their rates are above standard. I think so owners just ensure the girls are charging market prices to ensure some punters don't get disgruntled at their shops when girls reach for a higher tip than punters may be used to.Quote:
Originally Posted by 11Bravo
Thanks schloong.
Well, lack of protection, bit more risk, but can lead to greater thrills... I mean, when you're ready to pay NNN, and she says NN, that's "cherry on top" time. If she says NNNN, perhaps it's "I'll have one scoop, not three", and maybe you can agree on "two scoops".Quote:
Originally Posted by crum
Ruining the mood? Really? I have a ceiling, she has a floor. If the two intersect... start building. If not, change the floor plan.
Seriously, I never worry about what others pay. I know the going rates. I know what her experience is worth to me. FOMA? I can live with that. Best thing is, I tried. If it didn't work out, then her experience just wasn't worth it to me. AND my money just wasn't worth it to her. It's not THAT serious. I don't take it personally. If I want fixed prices for fixed services, I'll go to a brothel. Knowing how to, I wouldn't call it "negotiate", just "agreeing on", that's just part of punting. You're shortchanging yourself if you don't know how to do it.
11bravo, are you an english teacher:shout:? Every time i read one of your post, i feel like im back in high school.
Time to give the massage parlours a rest and visit the brothels that have a 1 price tier that way no one is swindled. All this Gold,Diamond pricing is just an upsale for only the girl to end up not doing the whole package anyway or trying her best to avoid any bare foreplay happening.
Negoatiate with the massage ladies and always remember to think with your brain not your cock!
I think they get advantage of how vulnerable are the punters. Many people when they walk into a brothel or massage shop are extremely nervous and feel ashamed of themselves (also feeling very horny lol). That makes you an easy target to comply with anything. And one should also keep in mind that most clientes don't spend their time in forums exchanging information about which shops or what girls are better.
FMTT. Isn't there an age check for membership?
bold for emphasis:
Advantage of how vulnerable punters are? Say what? You feel vulnerable when your pants are around your ankles? Well, sure, in PRISON. But in an MP or brothel? Have to be honest, never thought of "Cross of Iron" while I'm getting fellatio (ah, Peckinpah).Quote:
Originally Posted by SiberianKhatru98
Feel ashamed of themselves? Really? Sure I use a back door when available, not because I'm ashamed, but because I'm careful. So many clowns who have big mouths. You see, some contracts mention "moral turpitude"... Such a quaint term... But the locker room talk doesn't play too well during security checks.
That makes you an easy target to comply with anything. REALLY? Myself, I can say NO in any number of different languages. Full disclosure, just today, I did comply 3 times:
- 1 hour - please pay $80
- Please take off your clothes
- Please turn over
That's about it for MY compliance. And never felt COMPELLED to do any; WANTED is the appropriate word. (The "fuck me harder" - that's just script, but yes, I still complied.)
Maybe that's why a number of punters want young ladies. If older, they'll accede to the authority figure, "Yes, mother, I'll just do it myself..."
Think you might be projecting onto others (OK, I do that too, though I call it (I say Russian, you say Spanish)).
Bottom line - it's BUSINESS. Be polite, be respectful. The ole "do until others..." But everything that happens in the room should be by MUTUAL agreement; either party can say "no thank you".
I'm starting to get put off by Japanese ML as service quality has slipped in spite of extra costs rising. Calling out J girls in particular as girls from other countries continue to charge standard prices with same levels of service. In one instance, they asked $100 for a nhj and when I politely declined that it was out of my budget, she stared angrily at me, it was quite unnerving seeing her silently staring daggers into my soul. To snap her out of it, I requested to continue the massage instead much to her chagrin. She started squirting oil on me and when I said no oil thanks, she said ok but kept doing it anyway. During the massage, I could feel her digging her fingers into me like she wanted to cause pain. Never experienced attitude this bad before, much less from a Japanese ML who, in the past, provided exemplary levels of service.
I hope you paid after because I would have walked out and paid nothing after that disgusting behaviour.Quote:
Originally Posted by blanet
If they want cash they should get an abn and go work in a brothel.
Payback's a motherfucker... Even Japanese can feel like a woman scorned. I've certainly told several (non J) to just continue the massage when presented with an (for me) OTT price. Would do it with anyone. But I do understand she is free to ask whatever price she wants.Quote:
Originally Posted by blanet
When presented with an intractable situation, I've just said "We're FINISHED here", gotten up, and started to get dressed. My PERSONAL red line is when I've gotten my shoes on. Up to then, open to negotiations.
But after, we're out the door.
In your case, I would have written off the remainder of the massage price paid for, dressed, walked, accepting the MUTUAL disagreement. Taking it as a lesson learned: ask extras' prices at the start.
Paid nothing? You (general you here and on) did receive a partial amount of the STATED services, MASSAGE, at least up to the disagreement over EXTRAS, which were NOT within the stated services. So you would owe something. And it was YOU who decided to stay, accepting said treatment (I'll assume the masseuse was not pointing a gun to your head). If you walked early, yes, you would be entitled to a refund of some sort. I would mention it to the manager, along the lines of "I said no oil", "I said too hard but she continued"... No action is acceptance. Now don't get you panties all twisted in a knot; I'm not defending the girl. But if you stayed full time, you owed full time TO THE SHOP. And if you walked early, you might be due a refund, but think it would depend if you were a regular or not, which isn't exactly fair, but it is life.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pattyherb
Bottom line: differentiate between the shop and the girl and the fees owed each. Didn't you mention it took you several shops before you found one that would accept pay after? Somehow, that doesn't surprise me. Because I understand what makes pay after work, and what fucks it up for ALL.
Only paid massage fee. But her whole attitude was off right from the get go. For first time visits, I try to put the ML at ease by making light conversation, I thought it was going fairly well but towards the end when I asked her something she ignored me and then left the room without saying a word to collect the towel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pattyherb
I should have ended it sooner like you say. I'm just glad she didn't harm my body during her wrath and she didn't get a tip. I've never asked extras prices from the start as I prefer to let things progress naturally but will consider doing so in future.Quote:
Originally Posted by 11Bravo
It's probably a good idea to report that to the shop owner if it happens and and send her any photos of marks she left.Quote:
Originally Posted by blanet
Additionally, it's absolutely disgusting that a punter gets assaulted amd abused by ML and there are people here defending them straight away.. these people are part the reason why the punting industry sux now
Also, what she did besides assualt is a criminal offence and actually coersion.
OK, she (pick one): Didn't Understand. Didn't want to answer. Didn't hear. Didn't care. Wasn't a Chatty Cathy. And...?Quote:
Originally Posted by blanet
You've been a member for 12 years and don't know how to handle an irked provider? REALLY? "Harm your body"? What, did she have a black belt? Yellow? White? Nunchucks? I've seen some very LONG nail extensions, not particularly on masseuses, but still... Or maybe any scratches would face the wrath of another... Look on the bright side, like you say - she threw her tantrum without your dangly parts in her fingers.Quote:
Originally Posted by blanet
Didn't give a tip? OMG, you are hard core! Who tips? You pay the agreed SERVICE CHARGE, and a tip is repeat business. Where'd you go to punting school?
"Progress naturally"? It's BUSINESS. She's there to make money from extras. Everyone (nope, I'm wrong), MOST understand that, but some seem not to understand RnT. You're there to pay money for said extras. If you agree, great. If not... you've BOTH lost time. And in BUSINESS, time IS money. Just ask anyone working on commission. (For the obtuse, and they are among us - a brothel, it's mostly a guaranteed service for a guaranteed price. For RnT, it's OPTIONAL, services AND prices, TBD. GEESH).
OBVIOUSLY, she could have handled it better. NO excuse for her behavior. But you are not entirely faultless. When she started to swerve, you could have grabbed the wheel rather than sit passively watching the disaster unfold. Who knows, maybe she thought you wanted a HARD massage (to loosen your tight wallet muscles...)
Myself, no need to get violent. Words work. Now, if you say "Stop, that hurts, knock it off", that ain't gonna work. But if you use your COMMAND VOICE, as in "STOP, THAT HURTS, KNOCK IT OFF", that does work. They (command voice works in multiple situations) might not understand the WORDS, but the TONE... (probably a good thing a lot of Asian languages are tonal), that achieves the desired result.
And as it WILL come up, no, it's not reciprocal. I condemn the girl, but I'll also find fault with the guy a bit. Reverse the situation, it's the guy alone. She doesn't have to say an explicit NO, just an implied, or better agree. But with a guy, silence is consent. That's just life; grow up.
No disrespect meant, blanet. But come on, voice your displeasure, walk away. If that's the worst spiteful provider you'll face, be thankful.
You know, there's the letter and then the spirit of the law.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pattyherb
She might just appreciate the photos. Pin it up on her wall, with a sign: IF YOU DON'T PAY, YOU'LL GET A FINGER, 5 FINGERS, 10 FINGERS (aka a double eagle).
Punting industry sucks? Yes, it does, happened to me just today, right there, NO protection at all... But the forum does leave something to be desired (MyBadWilly2, where are you when we need you?) A post about an irked, spiteful provider? OMG, has no one here ever seen one before? (Just add in drunk and have some REAL fun in your bedroom). Like I said, it WASN'T Cross of Iron. When you're old, you do bruise (believe me). Again, today, the provider was pressing hard. But, because I accepted it, I just "screamed and cried like a baby"... nah, it was just obvious she'd made a lot of dumplings from scratch, kneading dough... had strong hands. But if I wanted her to lighten up or stop, I would have asked... guess that IS shocking to some, talking to the provider.
Assault? YES, but more an indication of stupidity if you just lie there and take it. For all she knows, you might be a masochist...
Coercion?!? (the practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats). What, by shooting daggers from her eyes. Pressing hard with her fingers? Without a doubt, that can hurt. So, unless you're a mute (is that PC these days?), or have no motor control (apologies to those afflicted), stand up... YES, FELLOW PUNTERS, STAND UP, ROLL OFF THE TABLE, STAND UP, RISE UP FROM UNDER THE POWERFUL FINGERS, THE PAINFUL FOREARMS, THE SHARP KNEES OF THE OPPRESSION OF THE ABUSIVE PROVIDERS, STAND UP AND... walk out the door. No need for a revolution here (nor tip).
No disrespect to the OP. But to PussyHerb... I can just see the court case:
- Judge: Next.
- PH: Your honor, I was assaulted and coerced. I was in an MP getting a massage from a Japanese girl. Then I asked the girl for a NHJ.
- Judge: In a brothel, correct.
- PH: No, it was an MP.
- Judge: HMMMMMM.
- PH: She said $100.
- Judge: So she politely declined your solicitation?
- PH: No, I just didn't want to pay HER price. I requested her to continue the massage.
- Judge: And...
- PH: She was throwing daggers at me.
- Judge: OMG. Ninja daggers? How did you dodge them?
- PH: From her EYES...
- Judge: Oh.
- PH: Then she poured oil on me.
- Judge: WHAT?!? Hot boiling Ninja oil? That's horrible.
- PH: No, massage oil. But it was a bit cold. I shivered a couple of times.
- Judge: Oh.
- PH: Then she jabbed me with her claws.
- Judge: WHAT?!? Ninja Tiger Claws?
- PH: No, just her fingers, but they were STRONG. She might even have had nail EXTENSIONS.
- Judge: Oh. So you ran away.
- PH: No, I just laid there.
- Judge: WHAT?!? She used a Ninja poison dart on you to paralyze you?
- PH: No, I just laid there, but she wouldn't stop.
- Judge: So, she had gagged you with a Ninja gag?
- PH: No, I just laid there.
- Judge: Due to... manliness? Stupidity? Couldn't speak to a girl?
- PH: I just wanted the massage to finish.
- Judge: Wouldn't you worry that those powerful fingers could do some damage to your herb?
- PH: No, it's a small herb so I never have to worry about fingernails; they just dig into her OWN palms.
- Judge: Oh. OK, yes, you were assaulted. I award you damages. But don't go outside again. You will be the joke of SYD wherever you go. Paralyzed by fear of a Japanese massage girl, non-Ninja. There will be no more laughter in the courtroom, Bailiff.
Apologies to all if she was a former pro sumo wrestler. THAT could keep you pinned to the table.
Oh, and PH, don't ever go to Thailand for Songkron. They throw water on you, and some of it is ICE water (GASP, SHIVER, SCREAM) and assault you with powder on your face and head. Assault and Coercion big time. Only solution is to bring a BIG gun (squirt gun or water canon) to defend yourself. Or run away (a solution I now use, given my age).
@blanet
Don't listen to this bs. What she did to you was assault and you should of report it to the police if she left marks, remember she assaulted you because you refused sexual services: that's court time for her
Personal trainers have ended up in the local court for touching their clients ass, what she did to.you was alot alot worse.
This post has gone off the rails 😅
u know it bro thats why the revolt....Quote:
Originally Posted by dwx
instead of listening to the ML go or change over or turn around pls turn over to the FS shops at least ur guaranteed to know what service you are getting ie diamond services and no need to negotiate
this is true for everything not just this activity.